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Talk:Pandora
Sorry for the aggravation caused by my update. I had read the Survivors Guidebook and just figured the Wiki needed an update. There are several inconsistencies between the movie scriptment, other sections of this wiki and several other pubs available on the web. For what its worth, CO2 is the main toxic component in the Pandoran atmosphere, although Hydrogen Sulfide is toxic as well. At CO2 concentrations over 4%, unconscionous quickly results. Likewise, extremely rapid, shallow breathing results from Respiratory Acidosis caused by Carbonic Acid forming in the lungs from the high CO2 levels mixing with moister in your lungs. This is the mechanism which regulates our own natural breathing rate. I would recommend leaving as is for now. I am faily certain that the component mixture is reasonably accurate for a volcanically active world and is consistent with the guide. Just a thought SanDiegoSwamp Pandora's Atmosphere: According to James Cameron's scriptment (pg 11), the atmosphere of Pandora is "a poisonous brew of ammonia, methane, CO2, oxygen and nitrogen. Even a little hydrogen cyanide." Kxetse a-ean 22:02, December 26, 2009 (UTC) Pandora's Atmosphere Then I would merely suggest that BOTH descriptions be consistent - because right now , they are NOT... Ok, so now the description of the atmosphere is consistent within the article. Where in the film does it mention the composition? Obviously the film is the primary source of information, but hydrogen cyanide and ammonia seem to be at odds with humans' response to inhaling it. If memory serves, inhaling trace amounts of cyanide gas can cause death in very short order. When Jake is suffocating near the end of the movie, he probably could not have been revived if that was the case. That scene alone seemed to indicate that CO2 was the only significant toxin, since Jake was able to recover fairly quickly once he had his mask on. Anyone remember/have access to authoritative source material on this matter? Calvert4096 05:16, January 3, 2010 (UTC) As few people know, the xenon makes the human to feel numb, thought it is an inert gas and doesn't react with other substances. After few seconds of inhaling in the Pandora atmosphere the human body will grow numb with quite predictable effects. Lanso, 01:20, February 3, 2010 Make Paragraph and Panel Atmoshpere descriptions consistent Fixed - Inconsistency with other articles The exopack article says "Pandora's atmosphere would be easily breathable if it wasn't contaminated by a pungent mixture of hydrogen sulfide and chlorine." Which is at odds with the description here 04:37, December 27, 2009 (UTC) Atmospheric consistency There appears to be several inconsistent references - I deferred to Cameron's own work rather than others - and only wanted the current paragraph and side-panel to be consistent to each other and Cameron's exerpts. That is the current basis. Should more substantial and complete information arise with confidence, then these two congruent descriptions can be revised further and together... The Avatar guide book I have states that the atmosphere contains hydrogen sulfide, yet the movie states its hydrogen cyanide. This must be an error on the books side, and is probably causing the confusement. Wormulon 16:49, December 27, 2009 (UTC) Farutichah' 16:56, December 27, 2009 (UTC) - Then PLEASE edit the ENTIRE article for consistency - i.e. the parapgraph as well as the panel to the right. My ONLY desire here is to have both descriptions on the SAME page be the SAME also. There has been more dialog on the so-called facts of the atmospheric content than the SIMPLE agreement between two descriptions on the SAME page. This is sad - only... Day/Night Cycles I have lots of questions about day/night cycles on Pandora. At the distance Pandora is located from Polyphemus, shouldn't it be tidally locked with the planet ? Just like our own Moon is with respect to the Earth ? Second, if Pandora is indeed tidally locked with the planet, wouldn't the day/night cycles actually depend on the time it takes to complete a revolution around Polyphemus ? That might actually mean day/night cycles that are equivalent to several days/nights on Earth. There is no suggestion in the movie that it is the case though. Another point is that, if Pandora is tidally locked, an observer on the "far side" of the moon could not see Polyphemus in the sky (or, at best, could see only a small fraction of it due to "libration"). Nights on that side of the moon should be darker then, shouldn't they ? 00:06, January 2, 2010 (UTC) I have recently updated the Pandora page with a day/night cycle. This information is a fact: Pandora receives significant light from Alpha Centauri B(ACB). Because of this, for half the Polyphemian year its nights are never dark, but instead are more like Earthly dusk. At the closest point in its orbit, ACB is about 2,300 times as bright as Earth's full moon; at its farthest, it is still one hundred and seventy times as bright. During the other half of the year, when ACB is in the daytime sky, many Pandoran nights are illuminated both by Polyphemus's huge disk and reflect light from other nearby moons. Truly dark nights are uncommon. Polyphemus occasionally eclipses ACB at night for about one hundred minutes, but the light reflected by the planet still keeps the night from being dark. When ACB shares the daytime sky with ACA, at its closest it adds about half a percent to the total illumination. When the 2 stats are close together in the sky, the effect of ACB's more orange light in unnoticeable, but as they separate over the years, an orange tint may be seen in areas shadowed from ACA's direct illumination. At its most distant, ACB is about 2,700 times dimmer than ACA and does not produce noticeable lighting effects. However, it still appears as a blindingly-bright tiny orange disk in the sky. Because of its high axial tilt (29 degrees), Pandora exhibits considerable annual variation in the day-to-night ratio. In addition, its elliptical orbit produces seasonal temperature variations and a range in daytime illumination of about ten percent. -Avatar- 00:24, January 2, 2010 (UTC) :As always, sources please? The day/night cycles are interesting, but it would be nice to know where you found said information. Kxetse a-ean 06:49, January 2, 2010 (UTC) if you read my heading you would have realised that i up dated the page on Pandora. and me saying its a fact means i have given a source at the correct location to which i explained it to be at. so maybe you should drop by there and check it out :) -Avatar- 07:44, January 2, 2010 (UTC) :I didn't see a reference specifically cited, though the bottom of the page does refer to the Activist Survival Guide. I wasn't able to find anything in the guide that talks about Pandora's cycles. Maybe I missed it, can you give me the page? Sorry for being a pain, I just feel the sources should be clearly indicated when the information isn't plainly from the film. Kxetse a-ean 07:49, January 2, 2010 (UTC) under the source you are talking about there is another, James Cameron's Avatar: The Game (Pandorapedia) there is a Pandorapedia in the actual game. it has everything from a-z in it about pandora, na'vi and everything about avatar. literally everything lol. it covers from every single flora on the planet to fauna. na'vi and their culture, armour that determines rank, weapons. locations and planets. just a few points of at least 100 articles if not more. i went through the other day and took 3 hours to read, has some very useful information which i will be sharing with this wiki when i have the time :) -Avatar- 09:08, January 2, 2010 (UTC) : Interesting, thanks for sharing and taking the time to do so. We'll get a reference link so that we know where to find that info more clearly in a future edit. I have the XBox game, but no XBox (yet). :) Kxetse a-ean 10:12, January 2, 2010 (UTC) ::I don't have access to any of the aforementioned references, but as far as the two suns are concerned, the description above seems to be consistent with what science would predict in terms of sky appearance on any fictional planet in the habitable zone of the Alpha Centauri system (e.g. the two stars appearing together in daytime for half of the year and appearing alternately in daytime and at night in the other half). As mentioned though in the discussion page, I find it puzzling that no source has apparently discussed the issue of tidal lock with Polyphemus, meaning possibly several Earth days of light/night and implying that the gas giant could not be seen in the sky over approximately half of the moon. Furthermore, the axial tilt mentioned in the article seems to be purely speculative, unless it is backed up by some canonical source (is it ?). 10:46, January 2, 2010 (UTC) Out of Habitable Range Sorry for the re-post from the Polyphemus discussion. So there is a small problem with the theory that this planetary system is positioned within a habitable zone of the Alpha Centauri system. To be brief in my findings, the distance that Jake and his compatriots travel to Pandora is significantly short of the habitable zones of Alpha Centauri A or B, as well as the closest star to us Proxima Centauri. According to an NPR article the ship travels at approximately 70% the speed of light, or 209,854,721 m/s. This gives us a distance of 4.203 light-years, which falls 0.0398 light-years short of Proxima Centauri and 0.1668 light-years short of the Alpha Centauri binary system. Please see the math below for an explanation. 209,854,721 m/s = 70% of c 189,341,556s in 6 years 39,734,219,408,085,876m traveled 4.203 light-years = total distance (from Earth) traveled 4.365 light-years = distance from Sun to Alpha Centauri AB (6.264616888e-26 to 1.991253225e-25 = range of distance between ACA and ACB over a 40 year cycle) 0.00015813070221621 light-years = distance from Sun to Earth 4.3698 light-years = distance from Earth to AB 0.1668 light-years = distance from ship to AB Moreover, the gravitational and angular momentum effects of this system preclude the formation of gas giants like Polyphemus. 4.243 light-years = distance from Sun to Proxima Centauri 0.00015813070221621 light-years = distance from Sun to Earth 4.2428 light-years = distance from Earth to Proxima Centauri .0398 light-years = distance from ship to Proxima Centauri Moreover, Proxima Centauri is a flare star which means torrents of charged particles would strip off any atmosphere without a magnetic field. Pandora may indeed have this magnetic field as long as part of the inner structure remained molten, this is not possible for its gas giant parent planet. 6.991759919e-27 light-years = distance from ACA necessary to support life 3.915385555e-27 light-years = distance from ACB necessary to support life 1.286e-28 to 3.02e-28 light-years = distance from Proxima Centauri necessary to support life Almost the same size? The intro states: "Pandora, despite being almost the same size as Earth, is only a moon of the gas giant Polyphemus, which has thirteen other moons. However, due to its smaller size, its gravity is lower than Earth's." so what is it? is it almost the same size and its gravity is (fractionally smaller) or is it slightly smaller and less massive and therefore its gravity is less? (BTW, although there are several dialogue references to lower gravity, there seemed to be little evidence of lower gravity in the actual physics of anything other the Na'vi's physique and physical abilities, and the massive flora. (i.e. the humans moved liked humans under 9.8mss and objects seemed to fall at 'normal' earth gravity acceleration.) CO2... Actually, CO2 diffuses into the blood, lowering the pH-value of the blood despite the phosphorous acid buffer. This activates the breathing centre of the brain. The result is hyperventilation after some time and the eventual coma to save as much oxygen as possible. The brain cells slowly start to die once the oxygen need still cannot be satisfied. But if you go for the insanely high amount of CO2 in the air from the article (18%! Even 8% are extremely deadly...), you would have even less than a minute before you lose consciousness (as mentioned in the film) and the pH-value would sink enough to damage the body, even when you disregard suffocation. Heart failure because of an increasing heart rate would also play a role if it wasn't for the fact that you are in coma (and basically dead because half your brain cells are gone) long before your heart fails anyway. navi rosetta stone sorry to change the subject (my cumputers gliching so i cant go on the IRC) but i just wanted confirmation on that there was a Navi rosetta stone and if so could you give me a link to the possible link, thank you!Mehwa 03:18, October 1, 2010 (UTC)mehwa :From the Na'vi Language article: "The Na'vi have a tribal communal culture. They have no written language. Their history is passed down through stories." That should answer your question. Faern. 3D-HD-Pics 04:48, October 1, 2010 (UTC) : :thanks for the info but I was thinking more allong the lines of na'vi rosetta sones for sale soo I can become more fluent in the na'vi language. i belive they teach you through verbal, visual etc. thanks though!Mehwa 00:31, October 5, 2010 (UTC)mehwa :I think that this site might help you: http://www.learnnavi.org/ . I'm not familiar with exactly how it works, but it looks fairly user-friendly. OZZY 05:18, October 5, 2010 (UTC) : :thanks OZZY but thats were i herd of it. if we could find it then all of those inspiring Na'vi languistic learners could all get a big hand Biology Ok, teach me please. Which sentences? Biology was one of my best subjects in university. At least Human Biology was. ;-) :"The trees and plant life of Pandora have formed electrochemical connections between their roots that effectively act as neurons and create a planet-wide "brain"" :Read your sentence again and lookup what neurons and synapses are and think about what might be their counter-parts projected on the trees. ;) Faern. 3D-HD-Pics 22:24, January 30, 2011 (UTC) Sorry, but I spent so much time and did so much editing on this page last night that I don't even recall changing anything in this sentence. I know, footprints don't lie ... maybe my frosty feet were merely tiptoing or stumbling their way around. But, to reach back into my dusty archives, I think that synapses are the connections between the neurons? Thanks for the lesson maestro. ;-) :You are always welcome. :) Faern. 3D-HD-Pics 22:54, January 30, 2011 (UTC) Problem with reference link I've come across a problem with the link in the References section: when I try to follow the link, I get a "Page Not Found" error screen, and I then get redirected to the Academy's main page as it is now. I'm guessing it's either an outdated/removed page problem, or a typo in the link (it could also be a problem with my internet... PDFs and dial-up just don't go together). OZZY 00:29, February 22, 2011 (UTC) :Here seems to be another copy. Maybe, you could download it as PDF and upload it here in the wiki and then change the link to it. That way, it wouldn't go 404 anymore. Faern. 3D-HD-Pics 02:19, February 22, 2011 (UTC) :Thanks for finding that, though it might be a bit much for my internet to upload it at the moment: my sister has done an unnatural amount of Facebooking today, I'm pushing the boundaries of what dial-up can achieve just by being here now =P OZZY 08:59, February 22, 2011 (UTC) :(, it's saying that pandora is better than our mother earth.... ,'(